After reading the brief autobiographical excerpt from Mary Crow Dog, I want you to think about and answer ONE (you can address more, but don't feel obligated to do so) of the following questions:
1) What connections do you see between what we learned about primal religions in the Brodd book and MCD's experiences?
2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
3) When MCD states, "Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions" (52), does it remind you at all of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting?
4) Is there anything strange about tribes that traditionally did not use peyote using peyote in the modern American Indian Movement?
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The story of Mary Crow Dog is very inspiring, and it teaches you how an Indian women was treated. Something that particularly stuck out to me was that her best friend, Annie Mae Aquash was killed for being too strong and wise. The women were expected to keep quiet and tend to themselves and their families. Indian women are not treated fairly, and this is truly portrayed in Mary Crow Dog’s story. I also found it shocking that her baby was taken away from her when he/she was only an enfant. When Mary Crow Dog stated, “if you plan to be born, make sure you are born white”(47), I was very shocked because someone should value their culture and way of life, not advise others to not be like them. Clearly, she was unhappy with the Indian traditions and rituals.
ReplyDelete2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDelete- I think the skin piercing is a very interesting ritual. Although I don’t completely agree with it, I think its different and I understand why the Indians do it. I found it very interesting how Mary Crow Dog started crying when she saw the skin piercing because she thought it was so beautiful and she sensed the strong feeling between the different people and tribes. I feel that being a part of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance brings you closer to the tribe, which is why I think that people want to do it. Although it sounds very painful, I believe that one cannot judge until you experience it yourself.
3) When MCD states, "Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions" (52), does it remind you at all of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting?
ReplyDeleteThis quote from Mary Crow Dog reminds me of Ninian Smart’s analogy. Smart explains that when Religion A and Religion B interact there are multiple outcomes. One is when A takes on B characteristics and gets a little B-ified, and vice versa. The next is when A decides that B is a threat to their faith, and as a result become more extreme in their beliefs: AA, and vice versa. When the Christians tried to “Christianize” Mary Crow Dog, she noticed “the men who had brought us whiskey and the smallpox had come with the cross in one hand and a gun in the other. In the name of all-merciful Jesus they had used that gun on us.” Mary Crow Dog said that the Christian men used violence as a tactic to convert the Indians; MCD wanted no part of their hypocrisy. She realized that their way of life was not something that appealed to her, and maybe even felt a little bullied into it. As a result, she then turned more fervently to her Indian traditions.
2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteThe skin piercing ritual is a very interesting one. Although I would never partake in this ritual, I appreciate their enthusiasm for the creator and how much pain they are willing to go through to connect not only with the creator, but with their tribe as well. To be honest, I think that the skin piercing ritual associated with the Sun Dance is a little unnecessary. We have studied other religions that have had connected with their main god or creator in much easier ways. However, I found it interesting how Mary Crow Dog began to cry when she saw the skin piercing because of how beautiful it was to her. Even though I do think this ritual is a little much, I admire how people in the tribe honor the Sun Dance and how they are willing to do whatever it takes to connect with the creator.
4.) I think that it is strange that tribes that did not traditionally use peyote began to during the American Indian Movement (hereafter, AIM). Although in the reading, Mary Crow Dog says that the first time she tried peyote, she finally felt connected to her history, many tribes historically did not need to use peyote because they had other forms of hallucinogens that fit with the themes of self-sacrifice, like the vision quest. The vision quest requires the person give a lot of themselves and even risk their lives to see a vision, and peyote is merely a hallucinogenic drug. I think her usage of peyote shows that she has actually strayed further than she could possibly imagine from her roots because she doesn’t even know how to achieve the same level of enlightenment. In my opinion, the use of peyote to stimulate visions is sort of a “cop out”. That is, the person could have spent four days either sweating or fasting, but instead they smoke narcotics. It somehow cheapens the experiences that those who cried out for a vision got because it’s now so easy to come across.
ReplyDeleteWhen MCD states, "Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions" (52), does it remind you at all of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting?
ReplyDelete- This reminded me of when Ninian Smart said that you could have more than one religion that has similar views. They are sort of meeting half way and their principles just add on to each other. There were some things that she did that reminded her of Christianity and they were weird to the white people but normal for her and her friends.
3) When MCD states, "Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions" (52), does it remind you at all of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting?
ReplyDeleteThat statement that Mary Crow Dog made, did make me think of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting. Smart's analogy (referring to religions) was that when A and B come into contact, they start to pick up each other's traditions and eventually A or B will refuse the other and want to be isolated from them. In Mary's situation, white people were trying to convert her people to Christianity. At one point, Indian religion was forbidden - children weren't allowed to pray Indian, men were put in jail for taking sweat baths, sacred pipes were broken, medicine was burned or given to museums, etc. But as it is said in the book, "As long as people prayed with the pipe or beat the little water drums, Indians would not vanish, would continue to exist as Indians."
2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteThough I do not completely agree and would never be involved in the skiing piercing ritual, i understand why they are doing it and what it symbolizes. It is extremely interesting how they go through the self inflicted pain for their tribe and their creator. I think Mary Crow Dog's opinion on Christians "content to let Jesus do all the suffering for them whereas Indians give of their own flesh," is an intriguing point. Though I do not necessarily feel strongly about wanting to partake in piercing my flesh with skewers, I do not believe that it is fair that the government banned their dances because it is something they feel so strongly about and they are doing it for the love of their people and religion. An example of showing how strongly they feel is when Mary Crow explained that she was tearing up as she was being skewered because "it was so beautiful" that she felt so close to all the people surrounding her. In conclusion, I do not necessarily want to be involved with the Sun Dance, but I feel that it is their tradition and they should be able to practice it in peace without the government calling them "barbaric."
2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteMary Crow Dog’s account of the Sun Dance was very eye-opening because she describes the deep connection that she encountered during this powerful ceremony. It is quite easy to judge from the outside looking within this particular ritual, and question “why are these people participating in such painful tasks?” However, reading Mary Crow Dog’s story was truly beautiful. She, (like I at first) did not completely understand the significance of the ritual. When she began to dance and offer her flesh, she dedicated and prayed for those who she dearly loved. I found her transformation of becoming “Wholly Indian” particularly interesting because the flesh offering becomes the missing piece and conformation of her identity. Though sacrificing her well being, she did not feel any pain but instead a rush of happiness which I found very fascinating.
I found this piece by Mary Crow Dog to be very interesting, and it taught me a lot about Native American culture. In answer to question 2, I find the skin piecing tradition to be very unique. I think it shows how strong the Native Americans are that they are able to do this. Yes, it is a form of self-mutilation, but the reasons they have for doing it are very good ones. It is a sacrifice, something that has been present in most religions in history, but instead of sacificing animals, they are sacrificing their own blood, which shows how dedicated they are to their faith. They are giving what is like the ultimate gift. A good comparison was made in the autobiography to Jesus Christ. His sacrifice on the cross is very important, of course, to the Christian faith, and since Christians are okay with this, they should certainly be okay with the Sun Dance ritual. The skin piercing is a part of their religion, and for that reason, it is very meaningful. These Sioux Indians are doing what most Christians would not have the bravery or faith to do. It shows how important religion is to them. Personally, I do not think I would ever be able to something like that because of the pain it would inflict upon me.
ReplyDelete2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteOne of the things that struck me most about the skin piercing portion of the Sun Dance was our initial reaction to it. In religion last week, when we were first exposed to the Sun Dance, I know I cringed and shuddered at the thought of piercing my own skin for the sake of a ritual. It seemed completely alien and extremely painful, and even now after reading Mary Crow Dog’s point of view, I know I wouldn’t have the courage to do that. However, as Mary Crow Dog pointed out, skin piercing in religion isn’t entirely abnormal, as Christ was pierced and suffered for us. The Indians participating in the Sun Dance are offering the ‘only thing they own’ and suffering for the benefit of being closer to their Creator and to help others. Although it seems strange to outsiders, it is beautiful to the Indians, as is evident when Mary begins to cry at the sight of it. The Sun Dance is a way of bringing others together in one dance, becoming closer to the Creator and the people, and is beautiful to the participants and the watchers. As an outsider, I do not believe I would do something like this, but I admire the faith of these people and the lengths they go to for their Creator.
When MCD states, "Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions" (52), does it remind you at all of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting?
ReplyDeleteMary Crow Dog’s statement, “Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions,” reminds me greatly of Ninian Smart’s ideas concerning the blending of religions. Smart believes that when two religious traditions meet, they will form blended versions of each other. However, he further states that some members of the old religions will reject the new, blended religions and will become excessively old-fashioned. I believe that this is the case in many situations in life. For instance, sometimes when arguing with someone I might agree with some of their beliefs, but when they say something I strongly disagree with, I might no longer agree with any of their beliefs and become very uncompromising. In this way when American Indian society began to disintegrate, people like Mary Crow Dog resented the white Americans and clung to their traditions more tightly than ever.
After a few sentences into this autobiography, I started reading it like it was a story instead of an assigned reading. It was so interesting, probably because of the sheer impossibility of some of the things that Mary Crow Dog says; what was normal (or at least accepted) for her people seems so different or shocking to us. One example is the skin piercing in the Sun Dance. While I can not say I completely understand it, I do understand why some Indians may feel that it is hypocritical for Christians to look upon this in horror while celebrating Jesus Christ for the almost the exact same thing. However, I think that Lame Deer is being too critical and dismissive when he says that Christians are content to let Jesus do all the suffering for them. That was a long time ago, and I am fairly certain that if any one of us saw a man being nailed to a cross now, we would not just stand there and watch contentedly. We can not control our past any more than we can control our future. As for the skin piercing in the Sun Dance, I find it interesting how Mary Crow Dog says she saw visions and heard voices. It made me wonder if I would have the same experience (not that I plan on trying it anytime soon). While we were taught as Catholics that bodies are temples and all that, this is an interesting perspective on sacrifice. I would not do it, and I don’t entirely agree with self-mutilation, be it for religious purposes or another, I do respect the honor these people have for their past
ReplyDelete2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteAt first, I was completely disgusted by the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance. Like many of my classmates, I was confused and unaware of why anyone would this to themselves and the spiritual aspect of it. After reading Mary Crow Dog, I was able to understand this ritual through someone else's point of view. She explained that "Indians give of their own flesh, year after year, to help others". I thought that was very powerful because Jesus gave himself up for us but the Indians are willing to sacrifice themselves for those around them and to those who believe what they believe. Mary at first did not understand the ritual but she "felt it deeply" and "understood it with [her] heart even though not yet with [her] mind." This was a truly beautiful line. Instead of letting her mind control her, she let her heart guide her spirituality. After reading her autobiography, I became less ignorant about skin piercing and appreciated how it can someone feel strong and more faithful.
3) When MCD states, "Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions" (52), does it remind you at all of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting?
ReplyDeleteNinian Smart stated that when two religions mix, they will each get a little bit of the other. In MCD's case, Smart's theory is incorrect. When MCD embraced Christianity, it made her revert to Indian traditions. MCD became more extremist of her own religion instead of accepting and adapting Christian traditions. MCD did not understand Christianity. Christians look up to Jesus, who is expressed as being merciful; however, when Christians showed up to the Americas, they were not merciful towards the Indians. This is one of the reasons why MCD does not like Christianity and went back to Indian traditons.
I found this article both very interesting and very enlightening. I liked getting to see a new perspective on the relationship between the US government and the Native American population. This article connected back to the Ninian Smart interview mainly in the quote "Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions" (52). As we discussed in class when religions meet there can be three different results, either they merge, peacefully coexist, or some people become staunch defenders of 'their religion' and refuse to associate with the other one. Though she is exposed to Christianity throughout her childhood, and it is even attempted to 'christianize' her, she still stays loyal to her indian roots. I think that this is a result of many factors. For example, the Christians she encountered were usually unkind and judgmental toward her and I believe that she always felt a desire to prove her self as a true Indian because she was iyeska (half-blood).
ReplyDelete4. I believe that the use of peyote as a whole is unnecessary and unethical. The way that Mary Crow Dog describes her peyote experiences is somewhat foolish, in my opinion. She believes that when she was introduced to peyote, she became closer to her Indian traditions; she became more Indian. She also quotes Crow Dog, who called the white men's world unreal, whereas, "The real reality is underneath all this. Grandfather Peyote helps you find it" (52). To me, calling peyote, which is a hallucinogenic drug, "reality," is ridiculous. Taking this drug makes everything very far from what the real world is like. It makes you see and feel things that are not really there. I understand why some other cultures would fast and torture themselves to see visions – this made them suffer, and once they had endured this suffering, they deserved to have life-changing visions. The peyote is a quick and easy shortcut to achieving these same feelings. By simply taking a drug, one does not become worthy of the life-changing visions that follow. In addition, the fact that when the AIM movement took place is when many tribes reverted to the ways of "medicine men," is strange to me. If the AIM movement was helping these people turn back to their teachings and beliefs, then they should need nothing more than their own faith to do so. They should not feel the need to induce imaginary feelings by taking drugs.
ReplyDeleteWhen MCD states, "Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions" (52), does it remind you at all of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting?
ReplyDeleteThis did remind me of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting however, what Ninian Smart described about mixing the religions and religion A becoming more like religion B and religion B becoming more like religion A did not happen in this case. MCD became more A "super A" like we talked about in class. The affect of her learning about christianity did not open her up to any new ideas it made her return to her old religious beliefs. When she did return to Indian lifestyle she was even more attached and believed in it more strongly then ever.
3) When MCD states, “Hand and hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions” (52), does it remind you at all of Ninian Smart’s analogy of religions A and B meeting?
ReplyDeleteMary Crew Dog’s statement practically does prove Ninan Smart’s analogy correct. Mary was a half-blood, or iyeskas. Her mother was an Indian, but was also a Catholic, and so she raised her daughter the same way. The nuns who taught her were very strict about what Christianity was about and often beat her. Then, Mary went to stay with her Grandpa Dick Fool Bull. She learned all about her Indian heritage and she could not get enough of it. She felt so happy, like a bit of her was found. Like the analogy, Mary was a Catholic, because her mother got her confirmed. When she exposed to the Indian religion, she could not let it go. In other words, she became religious in Christianity and in the religion of her grandfather.
) I think it is strange that the tribes that did not use peyote to enhance or spur visions began to after AIM. In my opinion it seems that peyote is an easy way out of the vision quest. The vision quest requires determination and strength to receive a vision. People risk their health to connect with the Gods. Although there are certain hallucinogenic aspects to the vision quest ( possible the starvation and dehydration) that could lead to a vision, peyote and the vision quest are quite different because peyote doesn't require any physical risk other than the fact that you are taking a hallucinogenic drug. I feel the people who actually went on the vision quest are more connected to their religion and much more dedicated, while the ones who simply sit around smoking or popping pills are almost "cheating" in a way. Especially in regards to what we learned so far about the people of these tribes, who pierced there skin and stared into the sun, while painfully dancing for hours or days at a time to worship their beloved sun god, it seems strange that they are ok with simply taking narcotics to become closer with their gods.
ReplyDelete2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteI find the skin piercing phase of the Sun Dance interesting, however, I find it primitive and unnecessary. Mary Crow Dog argues that she finds it contradictory that the Christians worship a man who suffered on a cross for their salvation, yet they find the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance to be morbid and barbaric. Though I do recognize her point of view, I find this argument to be irrelevant and not well thought out. Christians do not try to reenact the crucifixion of Christ, instead, they appreciate what Jesus Christ did for them. The Lakotas on the other hand try to reenact the suffering which, in my opinion, does not facilitate appreciation of sacred beings, rather, it just creates unnecessary pain, infection, and potential illness.
2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteAlthough I understand why they do it, I do not entirely agree with it. I know if I was in her position, I would not be able to. I was really intrigued by how they talk about Jesus doing the same thing. I would not have thought about it if they did not say it. I like how much they believe in their religion and how they will go to such great lengths to make their Gods happy even if it means sacrificing their own body. Now people may say they are religion but they do not completely accept it. By Mary Crow Dog’s description I can clearly see how attached they are to their Gods and the meaning behind it
In response question two: to what do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteThe Sun Dance ritual, although seems absolutely ridiculous when one first hears about it, can actually make some sense once you really try to understand the cultures. The idea of “speaking” to God is present in most religions. However, each religion has a different way of finding ways to communicate with God. In this case, they believe that it is best to pierce their skin to obtain the feeling that they have finally been able to speak with God. While I personally, think that there is another way to speak to God than piercing my skin and causing myself a lot of pain, these people thought it was the best way to be with God. They did it because they thought that if they could sacrifice themselves, and prove themselves worthy of God.
2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteI think that Mary Crow Dog's perspective on the Sun Dance was very interesting. While hearing about the ritual in class and watching the interviews, it seemed hard to even hear about. Taking that to the next level and wanting to participate in it shows a lot of courage. When Mary says that "I wanted to feel it, spiritually and in my flesh. It was real compared to what I had known, not a hand-me-down belief but a personal reawakening that stirred a remembrance deep inside me", that passage stood out to me. There are many things in a religion, such as stories or traditions, that are passed down from generation to generation. But to Mary Crow Dog, the Sun Dance was a way for her to really find her own way in her religion, not just living off of someone else's experiences. This is what you could consider one of the "experiential dimensions" of Ninian Smart's seven.
In the excerpt of Mary Crow Dog's autobiography I absolutely loved the sheer indignation she presented about the arrival and the power of the white Americans. I thought that it was interesting that she rejected everything that they said or did, even though she is half white herself. I also thought that it was interesting that she was half white, but didn't speak at all about her father. I wondered how he was in the mix in the first place. Unlike in our study of primal religions before, she mostly rejected all parts of Christianity. I liked her individuality and rather than being indifferent about her dislike of the white Americans, she was actively working against her counterparts. In hearing her point of view about why she dislikes white people, I can understand much better. I liked how when missionaries came to convert them to Christianity, she went deeper into her own culture and religion.
ReplyDelete@Maddi: I completely agree with you and I'm not even in your class. My own class reacted in a similar way, including myself and I like to pride myself on my ability to keep a straight face when other people squirm. While the piercing and tearing may seem completely inhumane and disturbing to us, to the Lakota it is both the highest and purest offering they can offer their creator.
ReplyDelete2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteMary Crow Dog’s stories were very eye opening into the way Indians were mistreated. This mistreatment was very unjust. They were looked down upon, along with their religion. Anyone who thinks the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance should be illegal isn’t an American of the United States. The Constitution explicitly allows for freedom of religion. Since the Sun Dance is so integral to their religion, it would be like taking it away. Also, self mutilation in any form isn’t illegal either. It may be frowned upon, but it is not illegal. Skin piercing is a form of self mutilation. When the Sun Dance festival was banned in 1883, it was banned on the terms of it preventing Indians from becoming non barbaric. However, people come to the United States so they can live the way they want; it should be allowed on every level unless it violates somebody else’s rights. I think the skin piercing is a very scary and daunting thing; however I don’t think it is bad in any way. Indians should be allowed to practice their religion in any way, just as we are. I think that people should stop looking at the skin piercing with a negative connotation and with more of a positive outlook with the view that the practitioners have.
2) What did you think of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteI am answering this question because I find that the most intriguing. Hearing it from Mary Crow Dog and her own personal experience changed my perspective on the Sun Dance. Like many others have already said, I cringed when I first heard about the sacrifice of tearing the flesh. Mary Crow Dog however, changed my opinion on the tradition (though I myself would still not take part in the skin piercing). It was inspiring to hear her story, and how she struggled to find her identity, especially being someone who grew up with two very distinct religions. However, the Sundance gave her and epiphany to her identity; she at that moment knew who she was. She said, “I felt nothing and, at the same time, everything”. I found this as an amazing moment, because I gained a better understanding of what the Sun dance means as I delved into Mary Crow Dog’s writing. She felt unified with both the earth, spirits and Creator in a harmonized way. I understand now that the Sun Dance does not only bring tribes together, but also with the spirits. It is truly remarkable for not only how brave these people are for making such a sacrifice, but also their faith and courage.
To answer question 2: What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance? At first after hearing an explanation of the practices in this ritual, I wanted to dispose of the image in my head, as it was incredibly brutal and gory. On the other hand, after understanding the Native Americans’ point of view, I was able to relate to why they may have done such a self-grueling thing. Although I do not necessarily agree with the ritual, I believe the Plain Indians do have a valid reason for such sacrifice. It is true that us Christians appreciate and celebrate the fact that our savior, Jesus, suffered for us on the cross and gave his life for us, but we do not require such grueling suffering from ourselves. This is just an example of how education leads to tolerance. It proves that by being educated about other’s religions, we can appreciate, respect, and understand their practices and lifestyles.
ReplyDelete3) When MCD states, "Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions" (52), does it remind you at all of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting?
ReplyDeleteMCD seems to be going back to her old traditions and religion in response to the new religion coming into her culture. She's going back to the old ways of her culture and is becoming more traditional, while at the same time she allows the culture around her to influence her and it changes her, and she thinks it's for the better. MCD seems to be the median between the two religions. She practices one, but accepts the other and the culture that comes with it.
2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDelete- Although I do not agree with the skin piercing, I find it very intriguing. To learn about these tribes inflicting pain on themselves shows just how devoted and courageous these men and women are. The more I know about this ritual, the more I appreciate it. When Mary Crow Dog cried at the sight of the Sun-Dance, and vowed to sun-dance for four years, this proved to me just how important the ritual is to all the Indian tribes. In a way, this dance is almost an equivalent to Christians going to church and praying to God. By piercing oneself and dancing all day long, these people feel a personal closeness with the creator. Mary Crow Dog said, "It was that moment that I, a white-educated half-blood, became wholly Indian. I experienced a great rush of happiness." These lines stood out to me because it showed how the Sun-Dance brings a person so close and so involved with their religion.
The closing sections of Mary Crow Dog’s autobiography (both “A Vow to the Dance” and “Wholly Indian”) were enlightening to me in terms of rationalizing the “piercing” aspect of the Sun Dance. Mary Crow Dog first acknowledges that she “did not pierce until the second year after [she] began living with Leonard” (59). In a sense, this humanizes the Native Americans who do in fact pierce themselves by informing us that the ritual is oftentimes just as scary to them as we perceive it to be. Mary Crow Dog waits until she feels ready to pierce herself to partake in this part of the ritual. In addition, Mary Crow Dog shares her experience in the Sun Dance: “I did not feel any pain because I was in the power…In the almost unbearable brightness, in the clouds, I saw people. I could see those who had died” (59). Having read an immediate account of the ritual, it seems less barbaric and more profound. The Sun Dance is not performed simply as a torturous method of human sacrifice: it is actually about so much more than that. It ties the participants to their religion through community, myth, experience, and ritual (see Ninian Smart’s 7 Dimensions).
ReplyDelete2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteMCD says that "I pierced too, together with many other women... I could hear the spirits speaking to me through the eagle-bone whistles. I heard no sound but the shrill cry of eagle bones. I felt nothing and, at the same time, everything. It was at that moment that I, a white-educated half-blood, became wholly Indian" (p.59). I have mixed feelings about the Sun Dance ritual, and what MCD says about it. It seems almost as if she is participating in this very extreme ritual just to prove that she isn't different from her pure-blooded Indians just because she is an iyeska. However, MCD writes so powerfully about how moved she was by participating in this ceremony, that some of my reservations about this controversial ritual were dismissed; however, she also mentions how Christians let Jesus do all the pain and suffering for them, but I think she is wrong in saying this because that was the whole point of Jesus' dying on the cross. His saving Christians from having to suffer is exactly why he did that, so MCD's logic is a lot off.
2.)What do you make of the skin piercing?
ReplyDeleteI found the skin piercing to be very interesting. Although i myself would never do it, i thought the significance behind it is very powerful and I as someone who is viewing this can understand why they do it, not just because they enjoy pain. In the passage i found it very interesting how she described not feeling pain because she was spiritually connected. The importance of this Sun Dance was especially clear when she cried at the sight of it. They compare themselves to Jesus in the sense that he suffered for us but they feel its necessary to suffer themselves. The more I've learned about this religion the more I appreciate it.
1. What kind of connections do you see between what we learned about primal religions in the Brodd book and MCD's experiences?
ReplyDeletesee many similarities between what we learned about primal religions in the Brodd book and MCD’s experiences. First, in class, we discussed how the U.S. Government saw some of the Indian festivals or rituals as being barbaric. Mary Crow Dog brings up this idea too when she says, “Up to the time of Franklin D. Roosevelt, Indian religion was forbidden… Christianizing us was one way of making us white, that is, of making us forget that we were Indians:” a very powerful and poignant quote. Americans forced Indians to conform to Christianity, thereby, forgetting their culture and submitting without a fight to a different religion. Another example of relating what we talked about in class to Mary Crow Dog is when she talks about being people of dying on page 50. She says, “We are a great people for dying. ‘It’s a good day to die!’ That’s our old battle cry.” We talked about in class the idea of sacrificing and even killing oneself for God, and this is exactly what Mary Crow Dog is discussing here. Finally, the last similarity is when Mary Crow Dog discusses visions and dreams on page 54. She says, “Dreams and visions are very important to us, maybe more important than any other aspect of Indian religion. I have met Indians from South and Central America, from Mexico and from the Arctic Circle. They all pray for visions, they are all ‘crying for a dream,’ as the Sioux call it. Some get their visions from fasting for four days and nights in a vision pit on a lonely hilltop. Others get their visions fasting and suffering during the long days of Sun Dance, gazing at the blinding light in the sky.” What Mary Crow Dog is describing here is the “hanblechia” or the Vision Quest. Those followers perform this vision quest in various ways: First, they could go to a sweat lodge for purification; next, they could seek solicitude; finally, they could fast. From this, they are supposed to receive a vision; however, we discussed in class the difference between whether it’s a vision or a hallucination. She then goes onto talk about the Sun Dance which we elaborately talked about in class and how that was a form of suffering for sacrifice as well.
3) When MCD states, "Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions" (52), does it remind you at all of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting?
ReplyDeleteThis quote from Mary Crow Dog did, in fact, remind me of Ninian’s Smart’s analogy of religions A and B meeting. Smart said that when religion A interacts with religion B, then religion A could become AA and religion B could become BB. In essence, this means that when members of the two religions interact with each other, then the believers of each of the two original religions can find faults in other religion and become an extremist in one’s own religion. In this case, MCD is describing the part of her life in which Christians were trying to convert Indians to Christianity. Being exposed to Christianity made MCD resent their influence on her own Indian culture, and she became a radicalized Indian as a result. To MCD, sticking to her Indian culture was “the most natural thing in the world” (52).
2. I find the skin piercing ritual in the traditional Sun Dance very interesting. First of all, I do not believe the so-called "Christian" governments of the U.S. and Canada really understood their own religion, never mind the Indian religious tradition. Generally, Christianity does indeed teach that suffering is a part of life and necessary for entrance into heaven. To suffer innocently is to suffer as Jesus suffered. Jesus received a wound in his side, not far from where the Indian peoples traditionally wounded themselves, as Mary Crow Dog explains, which was over the heart. Not only are the wounds very close physically, they are also very close in their meaning. How can one be allowed to be witness to the greatness of heaven or have the favor of the all-powerful sun, without sacrifice? This would be like avoiding homework and study and expecting a perfect grade on the test. In simple or cosmic terms, this does not make sense. As Mary Crow Dog also states, quite rightly so, "Christians are content to let Jesus do all the suffering for them whereas the Indians give their own flesh, year after year, to help others." Am I suggesting that now, to be faithful Christians, we must go out and ceremoniously mutilate our own flesh? Not exactly. Alternatively, we can accept the suffering we endure on a daily basis and take it as an opportunity to prove ourselves worthy of God and his kingdom. Moreover, we can take a lesson from the "barbaric" Indians: having a difficult time in your life is no longer, nor has it ever been, an excuse to believe God has abandoned us, and because of this to discontinue our worship and/or lose faith.
ReplyDeleteThe story of Mary's life was very interesting, though in some spots, it was hard to read because of certain actions that occurred. Reading about how the women were abused by their husbands, especially the majority who were habitually hit, was a bit of a shock, because nowadays, at least in our society, that's not a common thing, and it's one of the reasons a woman might leave her husband in our community. The story of the sun dance was also slightly disturbing, but in a way, the piercing makes sense because they want the gods to know that they care enough about them that they are willing to put themselves into that kind of pain to show it.
ReplyDeleteWhen I read Mary Crow Dog's story I was moved by it. And when she said, "Hand in hand with my radicalization went my going back to Indian traditions" (52), it did really remind me of Ninian Smart's analogy of religions A and B meeting. I think it reminded me of his analogy cause MCD talks about how she was one religion then changed to be more like the new religion and then changed back to her old religion.
ReplyDelete2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteI thought that this was a very inspirational reading. My initial response to these piercings were negative, but after understanding as much as I could, i find them meaningful. When Mary said that people take their self, body, after many years to help others, I found that interesting, because it reminded me of what Jesus did on the cross, which is a similarity with our religion and her religion. How far people go to feel connected to their creator is interesting, and especially when Mary cried when she saw these piercings. I found that especially interesting, because she was so happy to see people connecting to their religion, where as when we see it, we do not enjoy it like she does. Overall, I feel as if the piercings may not be necessary, but when we learn about them in a more personal way, they seem a little more significant and meaningful. It shows that the expression "don't judge a book by its cover" is indeed true, because you must read more to fully understand things.
2) What do you make of the skin piercing associated with the Sun Dance?
ReplyDeleteInitially, like many who have posted, I found the piercing in the Sun Dance to be exactly how the government in 1883 described it as “barbaric, superstitious, and preventing the Indians from becoming civilized” (p. 59). I cringed when we first learned in class about how the dancers attached hooks to their stomachs or collar bones and then leaned back until the hook tore from their bloody skin. The mere idea of piercing my skin for the sake of a ritual seemed unnecessary and sickening, however after reading about Mary Crow Dog’s encounter with this ritual it didn’t seem as strange or pointless as I had thought. I realized that the piercing for them was a way to become closer with their religion and their tribe through this ancient ritual that their ancestors had practiced, and Mary Crow Dog even says, “it was at the moment that I, a white-educated half-blood, became wholly Indian” (p.59). Although I recognize this and the fact that the ritual shows how brave and devoted these men and women are, I do not understand why inflicting such a degree of pain is necessary.